I've been busy making MDF terrain. But it isn't a 'fun' project - it's overhead.
Overhead - I've discussed it before - is what you need to play the game. A quick recap:
It can be mental overhead - the requirement to memorize many special rules or complex rule interactions.
It can be time - maybe spent building terrain for example *cough* cough* - or just model requirements - painting 300 rank-and-flank Napoleonics is more onerous than a 10 man skirmish warband.
It always surprises me when there is some random indie game that requires 100 minis per side. I mean - that's a massive investment in time/money... and you're probably making both armies yourself or relying on one mate...
It can be financial. I'd love to play Adeptus Titanicus but... ....half a $1000 to dip my toe in? Or Necromunda - hundreds of dollars of rulebooks before I even buy a single mini?
It could be space - the game needs a 6x4 table vs a 3x3; or you need to store bespoke terrain.
'Overhead' is my term for the combined cost/barrier to entry. What do you need - mental effort, time, or finances - to start playing?
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What prompted this recent interest in 'overhead' was the game Zone Raiders.
It's not a bad game. It's actually very good - probably the best game I bought in 2023 - it's motivated me to finally get into my MDF terrain pile. It's like a less dense, simpler Infinity with a proper Necromunda-style campaign, set in a very strong background reminiscent of the anime Blame. Nothing new, but sensible modern game design, with great atmosphere. I recommend it!
It has a very strong atmosphere/vibes and background (theme) but no major unique gameplay hook (thing) .....unless it is the giant artificial space habitat itself - the terrain, immunocytes and constructs that roam it; and natural (or rather unnatural) hazards.
Traversing the terrain is very important - most of your faction can leap, wallrun or grapple/zipline. Weapons are pretty lethal to exposed targets.
So terrain is important to gameplay.
The background and gameplay is tied to the terrain. Necromunda Matrioshka is a planet sized megastructure with hundred of layers - some levels are hundreds of kilometers deep. Decayed, labyrinthine ruins. Skyscraper sized automatons that rearrange the landscape without apparent purpose. Strange machines pulse with exotic nano emissions. Unchecked automated factories run wild, spewing noxious emissions or vital supplies. Immunocyctes (cyborgs) prowl the ruins and relentlessly hunt down sapient life - like the megastructures' immune system.
Terrain is very important to atmosphere and background.
Zone Raiders can (and encourages you) to use any random Infinity/Necromunda/40K/sci fi models you have lying around - easy. And you only need a half dozen to a dozen minis. So the mini time/painting cost is low. It's rules are consistent - not super simple, but simpler than Necromunda and Infinity - to which it will likely be compared. So mental cost is average. So far, pretty low overhead.....
....but it's terrain overhead is high.
Missions require: 9 scavenge tokens. 5 objective nodes. 5 cyborg generators. A railcarrier. A nano fabricator. 5 sentry nodes. 4 chemical/thermal hazards, and a radiation hazard.
There is lots of special terrain. Radiation, thermal, and nano hazard clouds. 4 supply caches. 4 data nodes. 2 sentry nodes. A neural scorcher. A nano fabricator. A biomedical reconstructor. A cyro chamber. Quantum anomalies. Scanner towers.
.....that's a shitton of rather specific scatter terrain you may not feel like making, even if you already have a truckload of Necromunda/Kill Team terrain lying around.
In addition there are more mundane terrain items; ducts, jump plates, forcefields, explosive containers, ziplines and lift platforms - which you still might not own.
In addition, to represent NPC enemies that may spawn (aka part of the terrain) you need a behemoth (mega cyborg/robot); a half dozen harvesters (normal sized) and half a dozen or so reapers (flying cyborgs). Not everyone owns flying insect cyborgs. So the terrain itself requires more models you need to own and paint.
Infinity is famously demanding for terrain crowded tables - but it's not as specifically demanding as Zone Raiders. I can use my middle eastern 28mm for Infinity. I don't need to paint special terrain spawned cyborgs or specifically make cyro chambers. The heavy emphasis on leaping, ziplines and wall-running demands verticality as well as line of sight blockers. It requires more specialized terrain than Necromunda or Infinity without the name brand of either.
TL:DR .....So what was the point of this post?
Most indie games rely on interesting background and atmosphere to make a splash.
Zone Raider's has great atmosphere and background (the star is the megastructure itself) - usually the biggest drawcard for a game; but in this case the cool background may also be its biggest barrier/overhead in the form of specific terrain (besides $90 postage for a physical rulebook but I digress).
The background may be the barrier as well as the drawcard.
A more generic, universal ruleset using 40K/Infinity weapons and gear; and allowing a wider range of terrain - rather than being so narrowly focussed on Blame! megacity universe - might have had it be more widely adopted (I don't see much online about it at all).
If you are designing a game - not only do you need to consider making others want to play your game....
...but also what what would prevent others playing your game?
....and, like Zone Raiders - is it an integral part of your game?
Example: I made a Hot Wheels racing game for my son a while back. What's the biggest overhead here? In this case - not terrain. Or cost (everyone has Hot Wheels lying about). Probably making the templates, as I explained the rules to him in a few minutes and he easily grasped how to play so it wasn't mental effort/complexity.
"A more generic, universal ruleset using 40K/Infinity weapons and gear; and allowing a wider range of terrain" -> has no hooks. It might be functional & streamlined & play well, but it's so generic hardly anyone will even check it out.
ReplyDeleteThat's what most people would say I suspect: - "I don't need another generic sci fi game (rules)" vs "Atmospheric Blame! anime megacity! (background)"
DeleteBut on the other hand, what if the atmosphere/background was also the (terrain, in this example) barrier that prevents people playing?
Trench Crusade is atmospheric but does not create the same barrier (i.e. trenches vs specific sci fi terrain)
Or does a background have to be bizarre/extreme like Turnip28 people push past it anyway (the 'fetish' end of wargaming?) :-P
I wonder if simply adding in some recognizably generic sci fi weapons/gear/missions would have allowed wider adoption whilst retaining the atmosphere? There are a few generic missions but they tend towards the 'do x with this special terrain piece.'
-eM
The One Page Rules are an example of a successful game that allows using GW miniatures without any other hooks than simplifying the convoluted GW games. It does seem to work for them. As I was thinking about getting into Necromunda, only to see the "overhead" of all the books needed, I thought about the OPR alternative "Gang Wars - Grimdark Future Firefight Expansion" which is only five bucks.
Delete"The One Page Rules are an example of a successful game... without any other hooks than simplifying the convoluted GW games"
Delete-What made One Page so big? I mean there are 101 'better 40K' games and I reckon half the folk interested in wargame design started out homebrewing a 'better 40K.' My 14 year old self discovered freewargamesrules website or whatever it was for that very reason.
-eM
"As I was thinking about getting into Necromunda, only to see the "overhead" of all the books needed..."
DeleteThis is literally what triggered my latest project.
My daughter bought an Escher gang - I saw the rulebook(s) cost and noped out. She enjoyed Blame! ....so I bought Zone Raiders and dug out some unpainted Infinity to oppose her.
I love ME:SBG but I'm very scared the new edition is going the Necromunda/codex route where you need many books to play.
...given I have ALL the LoTR armies.... it could be quite pricey...
...so I doubled down and am buying all the books for the old edition for 1/4 price...
-eM
That is a good question. I can only offer my own perspective and speculate on why they are so successful. I was initially drawn to the rules due to them really fitting on one page. I thought that this must be an impressive feat to distill the 40k rules to just one page. Unfortunately, for my RPG-influenced brain, the rules were just bland and boring. Therefore, I never tried them. Years later I was totally surprised how many PDFs they had on offer on Wargamevault. You could basically play an alternative version of any GW system.
DeleteHere are a few reasons on why I think that they are successful:
1. They started at the right time when a lot of GW customers were unhappy with the GW rules (there are always quite a lot of them, but they must have hit a sweet spot).
2. They took the step from fan project to product and further developed and expanded their product catalog
3. They offer
a. elegant rules which are not just a carbon copy of GW mechanisms
b. high quality PDFs with good structure
c. easy access to rules
4. They have a good business model with free basic rules and advanced rules that you need to pay for
5. They are moving away from just being a GW copy with their own miniature range (connection to 3D-print community) and lore.
6. They developed an intimate connection to their customer base (inclusion of feedback)
So, they avoid most of the pitfalls where other GW clones fail:
• No longterm engagement
• Bad distribution and presentation
• No own identity
“This is literally what triggered my latest project.
DeleteMy daughter bought an Escher gang - I saw the rulebook(s) cost and noped out. She enjoyed Blame! ....so I bought Zone Raiders and dug out some unpainted Infinity to oppose her.”
I love the idea of Necromunda (a narrative campaign in the 40k universe) but the execution is lacking. On the positive side, the miniatures are cheap by GW standards and you don´t need many. They also look interesting and seem like fun to build and paint. If I only had to buy the rulebook, I would be fine, but you also must buy some kind of codex FOR EACH gang for the full experience which is just as expensive as the gang box itself. I also read that full rules are scattered across several books (e.g. the core rule book, campaign books, etc.). Also, for some reason there is no cheap starter box like the ones for 40k or Kill Team. The starter box cost nearly the same as the deluxe starter box of 40k. Maybe I will buy some of these miniatures and use the Gang Wars rules from OPR or something from the Nordic Weasel Games catalogue. This would reduce the financial overhead.
The other overhead that I see for Necromunda is specialized terrain. You need a lot of buildings, and it seems like they should contain multiple playable floors. This means that I either must buy expensive terrain from GW or look elsewhere (MDF, 3D-Print).
“I love ME:SBG but I'm very scared the new edition is going the Necromunda/codex route where you need many books to play.
...given I have ALL the LoTR armies.... it could be quite pricey...
...so I doubled down and am buying all the books for the old edition for 1/4 price...”
I got interested into ME:SBG due to your positive review of the game, but I was put off by the apparent rules creep in newer editions and the high price point of rules and army books.
"I got interested into ME:SBG due to your positive review of the game, but I was put off by the apparent rules creep in newer editions and the high price point of rules and army books."
DeleteLet me be that voice whispering "you need more minis and games"... here's why:
While I felt there was rules creep; it is VERY minimal compared to other GW games and tends to be cinematic 'fluff' allowing you to mimic the books/movies with more(needless) accuracy - which you can ignore. The newest version removes some of them anyway. The core game is unchanged from 2001.
Unless you/your mates MUST have the new edition, this is the BEST time to get into it - get the older edition!
Which older edition?
You need a rulebook (one with gandalf the white on the front) and your choice of Armies of LoTR or Armies of the Hobbit. They should cost ~$15 USD ea used. Maybe toss in Battle Companies for some LOTR-Mordhiem 15v15 warband action. So $30-45 max.
If you are willing to use pdfs and google a bit, everything is 'free.' ;-)
Also everyone is selling their spare Rohan and Hill Tribes from the new starter for very cheap. So if you want to relive the Ride of the Rohirrim, now is the time!
3D printing is VERY good and prolific and I use it for heroes and special units which GW price by their points value, but to a 3D printer it is just another mini...
MESBG is GW's best game. (Sorry Battlefleet Gothic)
It is very recognizable and attractive to newcomers. It's core is simple, quick and familiar; and matches the feel (heroic combat) of the movies. It's surprisingly tactical. It's skirmish but scales from 10 per side to 50 per side.
My kids easily grasped it, and it'd be my intro game for new gamers - just avoid using fancy heroes at first which are kinda like light RPG characters.
-eM
I personally think indie games can only make it today if they have great visuals and are adopted early on by creative hobbyists with a strong social media presence. That's how Trench Crusade & Turnip28 managed to gathet a following. Strong rules in themselves are not enough, hardly anyone seems to care.
ReplyDeleteI suspect you are right.
DeleteHaving good social media presence (free advertising) help something succeed seems hardly revolutionary. And the most popular AAA games seldom have AAA rules and rely more on background.
But you made wonder.
I'm kinda curious now about what a game needs to succeed. What is 'success?' Is it lots of folk playing it? Or a fancy publication?
Frostgrave/Stargrave
OnePage Rules
Gaslands
Lion Rampant etc
Nordic Weasel
...or just first page on wargamesvault?
If its just getting published, the Osprey Ragnarok rules got a sequel yet I've never heard/seen anyone playing it online.
I also wonder if online presence is a true indicator of success? In the PC game War Thunder, there is two modes; arcade and realistic. Online, 99% of videos/media refer to realistic mode. However arcade is 3x more popular. The realistic folk are more invested in the 'out of game' experience. The arcade guys are too busy pew pewing.
Maybe some games are more focussed on the 'out of game' hobby/background experience? Like say Turnip28 etc? I mean it makes a cool Youtube modelling video but is it actually being heavily played.
-eM
My takeaway here is that indie games need a couple generic scenarios where the game can be enjoyed with minimal investment and create an appetite for getting into the "full" experience.
ReplyDeleteHistorical games seem to have a very low overhead as you can use your miniatures for a lot of games in the same epoch (basing could be an issue). In addition, you often don´t need a lot of elaborate terrain. You could get away with just a few hills and woods for nearly anything.
ReplyDeleteDepends on the period/ruleset.
DeleteNapoleonics in general have a huge barrier to entry, even if you can "amortize" your army for several rulesets. Few people but diehard grognards will even collect and paint such an army.
On the other hand, WW2 skirmish probably has a low barrier to entry, since it's easy to own and paint a bunch of soldiers for it.
Generic fantasy/scifi has an even lower barrier to entry (but then it's not historical).
I agree that some historical games have a huge overhead (or barrier of entry) due to the number of miniatures that need to be painted to play the game. Therefore, I would never play a historic mass battle game in 28mm (this also applies to WHFB). There are enough alternative miniatures though in smaller scales which should reduce the overhead. In addition, it seems like there is a skirmish game for nearly every period that can be played in the beginning with just one box of 28mm miniatures (e.g. Sharp Practice for Napoleonics).
DeleteI don't know the specifics of Zone Raiders, but if you're not too hung up on visuals, can you not proxy almost everything, minis and terrain (and build up your "actual" collection as you play and feel like replacing proxies)?
ReplyDeleteThat's usually my approach to tabletop gaming. I've been known to play miniatures games using bottle caps for minis (or self drawn standees) and boxes and assorted crap as terrain. Sometimes it doesn't matter, but of course it's subjective. I recently played a game of Operation Last Train with army men and random boxes for terrain, but bizarrely I obsessed about the dropship -- the least important element of the game -- and had to get it just right!
(I do like visuals and build/paint the proper stuff when I can, but sometimes a gamer who happens to be a dad without infinite time -- I know you can empathize with this -- must make compromises).
I tend to be very fast and casual painter/terrain maker but I do tend to have a 'if it ain't painted I ain't playing it' as it keeps me honest with my pile of shame.
DeleteHence Zone Raiders is 'forcing' me to paint Infinity and MDF :-).
Games with a strong background aesthetic like Zone Raiders tend to make me more fussy than generic sci fi rules...
-eM
Mental overhead – Choose/Develop simples rules like OPR, 5Core or Pulp Alley instead of complicated stuff like 40k, Infinity or Malifaux, where you don´t have to remember a thousand rules and special abilities. Offer beginner rules (incl. beginner scenarios) and advanced rules to keep the people interested in the game and maybe even serve a larger audience who like it more complex.
ReplyDeleteTime overhead – Either reduce scale or the number of models required to reduce the painting time. For me 15mm scale (1/100) seems to be a good scale where you could still do skirmish games with single models but also mass battles with group basing. Terrain should be easy to prepare and usable for multiple systems and maybe even scales (e.g. generic woods and hills, maybe buildings which work for a broader time).
Financial overhead – Nearly the same as for the time overhead applies here. If miniatures are expensive, like Fantasy and SciFi, the game should be with a low model count and playable with just one box of miniatures. If you need a lot of miniatures, it should be written for a smaller scale to reduce the cost. If you do a mass battle system, you should also think about abstracting the miniatures (e.g. a base of 4 soldiers is a full squad, platoon or a bigger organizational unit, instead of number of miniatures require a specific base size). Rule books should either include all the faction rules or addons should be cheap. A good starter box is recommended if you also offer miniatures (or cooperate with a manufacturer). From my point of view, a good starter box should contain the full rules, a quick start guide, two beginner armies and further stuff you need like dice, counters, etc.
Spatial overhead – If space is an issue, reduction of scale could really help. For example, Bolt Action scaled down to 15mm could maybe be played on a 4x2 table instead of the regular 6x4 table. For historicals, it is often easy to downscale as the same periods are served in multiple scales. With the emergence of 3D printers, it seems to also be the case for Fantasy or SciFi miniatures (e.g. Forest Dragon miniatures for WHFB or Warmaster).
For me personally, the most relevant overhead is really the time to prepare miniatures and terrain. I have a job and family; therefore, hobby time is often very restricted. The financial overhead is only felt if my wife is complaining that I added more miniatures to my pile of shame. I never had any problem with complex rules, as I started with Battletech and 40k 2nd Edition and also RPGs in the 90s.